Bali Vāsava Saṃvāda

The Bali Vāsava Saṃvāda is a pair of talks between Bali, the son of Virocana, and Indra (also called Śakra and Vāsava) in the Mokshadharma section of the Mahābhārata’s Śānti Parva. Bali once ruled all three worlds as the highest emperor. Now he has fallen. In the first talk (Chapters 223–224) he is born in a low body, and in the second (Chapter 227) he is a defeated dānava. Between them comes the account of Śrī leaving Bali and appearing to Indra (Chapter 225). In both talks Bali teaches Indra that kāla (time) alone brings every rise and fall, that the sense of being the doer (kartṛtva) is false, and that grief over what passes is pointless. Indra is humbled and goes away taught.

How the account begins

Bhīshma tells this talk to Yudhishṭhira in the Mokshadharma section. Yudhishṭhira has heard many teachings on vairāgya (giving up attachment). He asks about kings who lost everything and yet kept their calm. Bhīshma says, “Hear of Bali.” The account follows straight on from the Śakra Prahlāda Saṃvāda of Chapter 222. (Śānti Parva, Chapter 223)

Bali born as a donkey (Chapter 223)

Yudhishṭhira asks about a king who had lost his whole empire. Bhīshma tells it. Indra was at the height of his power. All the devas honoured him, all the lokas were in order, and the four varṇas were performing yajñas. Brahmā was content. The Rudras, Vasus, Ādityas, Aśvinī-kumāras, ṛshis, Gandharvas, Nāgas and Siddhas were all in attendance. Indra rode on Airāvata, the four-tusked divine elephant. In this state he asked Brahmā about Bali.

Brahmā told him that Bali, the great dānava king who had once conquered all three lokas, had been born as a donkey (gardabha) in an empty house.

Indra was astonished and proud. He went to look for Bali in this low form. He found him and began to mock him. He pointed to the royal signs Bali no longer had: the bhṛṅgāra (the golden water-vessel), the white umbrella, the cāmaras (fly-whisks), and the garland given by Brahmā.

Bali answered:

“O Vāsava! You mention my bhṛṅgāra, my umbrella, my cāmaras. They are hidden in the mūla-prakṛti (the primal ground). When my time comes, you will find them again.”

Then, though he was in a donkey’s body, Bali spoke to Indra with full dignity:

“O Purandhara! Beings of ripe wisdom (prajñā), content with knowledge (jñāna) and full of patience, do not weep in times of sorrow, and they do not swell with pride in times of success.”

(Śānti Parva, Chapter 223)

Bali’s first teaching: kāla and no personal doing (Chapter 224)

In Chapter 224 Indra laughs and goes on mocking Bali. Bali answers with a full teaching.

Kāla is the only doer. Everything that seems to arise, whether empires, victories, defeats, births or deaths, is the work of kāla (time, or fate) alone. Neither Indra nor Bali is the doer (kartā). Kāla does everything without anyone’s effort. As a fruit ripens on a tree by kāla, so kāla ripens all beings toward their set end.

“O Śacīpati! O Śakra! Neither I, nor you, nor any other is the doer. By kāla alone, without anyone’s effort, the worlds are known, ruled and consumed.”

All power passes. Bali tells of the turning wheel of power. Every empire and every high place is short-lived. Thousands of Indras came and went before the present Śakra. The place that now looks like Indra’s highest seat will itself be consumed by kāla. “Even the one who has conquered all the lokas cannot escape kāla when it comes for him.”

The body is not the ātman. Bali says plainly that his birth as a donkey is not his fault (na mama aparādhāt). Living beings (prāṇis) are made of the body (śarīra) and the subtle body (liṅga-śarīra). Both grow together and both perish together. Having a donkey’s body does not lower the ātman. The ātman is untouched by the station of the body.

“I did not become a donkey of my own will (na aham avaśaḥ). I have understood this clearly. Knowing this, what cause have I for distress?”

Kāla is an ocean. Bali calls kāla a great ocean (mahā-samudra), with no island, no far shore and no end. “This is the divine form of Vidhātā (the one who orders the cosmos).” The months, fortnights, days and hours are its waves. The seasons are its gates. Vāyu is its face. Those who know āyurveda understand kāla as the ātman of all, both imperishable (akshara) and flowing (kshara).

Calm is the answer. Bali tells Indra that the one who looks on all this calmly does not grieve. He sees that what was destroyed was destroyed by kāla, that what was born was born by kāla, and that victory and defeat are both the work of kāla. “So I do not grieve. Grief serves no purpose. The one caught in grief is taken over by rajo-moha (the dullness of rajas) and in the end is ruined by the loss of buddhi (clear thought).”

(Śānti Parva, Chapter 224)

Śrī leaves Bali (Chapter 225)

As the talk between Indra and Bali ends, Indra suddenly sees a shining figure leaving Bali’s body. She is a devī of great tejas, wearing armlets and crown-jewels, filling the space around her with light. Indra is amazed and asks who she is.

Bali, calm as before, tells him: “She is not a rākshasa woman, not a deva woman, not a human woman. I do not know her. Ask her yourself.”

She is Śrī herself, the power of good fortune, wealth and the order of dharma. She now shows herself to Indra and says who she is:

“I am Lakshmī. I am Bhūti. I am Śrī. I dwell in satya, dāna, vrata, tapas, parākrama and dharma.”

Śrī explains why she left Bali. He had once held fast to the Veda (veda-nishṭha), spoken truth (satya-vaktā), mastered his senses (jita-indriya), and performed yajña faithfully, honouring her every day. But as kāla turned, he fell into delusion (moha), began to revile the brāhmaṇas, and sank into adharma. When the brāhmaṇas left him, she left too.

Indra asks her to stay with him for good. Śrī agrees, but only on conditions. She tells him she has four pādas (quarters):

• First pāda. She dwells in bhūmi (earth). The earth carries one quarter of her, since it bears all beings with patience.
• Second pāda. She dwells in jala (water), in the flowing waters that serve and feed all.
• Third pāda. She dwells in agni (fire), where the Veda, the yajña and the presence of the devas are kept.
• Fourth pāda. She dwells in the sajjanas, the good people who hold to Brahman and speak only satya.

Indra accepts these conditions. Bali hears this and adds the teaching of anahaṃkāra, a song of giving up the sense of “I”. He says he knows his time will come again: in the next manvantara Bali will become Indra. For now it is the season of śānti (peace). Bali goes toward the south. Indra goes to the north and rises into the sky.

(Śānti Parva, Chapter 225)

The second talk (Chapter 227)

Chapter 227 gives a second meeting of Bali and Indra. This time Indra finds Bali in a mountain cave by the sea. He is not in a donkey’s body but in the form of a great dānava defeated in war. Indra comes on Airāvata with all the devas, fully equipped with his divine gear. He mocks Bali again for his fallen state: the loss of his wives, his wealth and his rule, the binding with Varuṇa’s ropes, and the blow of the vajra.

Bali answers with a second, longer teaching on kāla. It includes these parts.

The fallen emperors. Bali names the great daitya and dānava kings of earlier ages: Pṛthu, Ila, Maya, Bhīma, Naraka, Śambara, Aśvagrīva, Puloman, Svarbhānu, Prahlāda, Namuci, Daksha, Vipracitti, Virocana, Hiraṇyakaśipu and many more. Each of them once held the highest rule over the three worlds. All are gone now. “I cannot even begin to count the kings who have ruled this earth and departed.” What Indra holds now, others held before him and others will hold after him.

High place is not lasting. Indra’s present high place does not come from his own greatness but from the way kāla now arranges things. The same kāla that raised Indra will in time act on him as it has acted on all those before. “Whatever you do, whether you seem to win or lose, know that kāla is behind all of it. You are not the doer.”

Kāla is Brahman. Kāla is named as the cosmic Brahman. The ruin (nāśa, vināśa), the power (aiśvarya), the joy (sukha), the pain (duḥkha), the bondage (bandha) and the freedom (moksha) of all beings arise only through kāla. “Kāla alone is the doer. Nothing else is the cause.”

Bali’s advice to Indra. Bali finally advises Indra: “Give up desire for pleasures (kāmabhoga). Give up the madness that comes from wealth. Then, when your own rājya-śrī (the glory of your rule) leaves you, you will be able to hold your grief. Do not grieve in times of grief, and do not be elated in times of joy. What has passed, let it pass. What is here now, live with that alone.”

Indra is humbled by this teaching and honours Bali’s wisdom: “You see kāla clearly. Your buddhi has grasped the tattva (the truth). Rajas and tamas have not touched your mastery of the senses (indriya-vijaya). You hold to the ātman that is still (śānta), without friends or enemies, without liking (prīti) or burning grief (santāpa).” Indra shows pity and frees Bali from some of his bonds. He promises that when the time of the breaking of dharma comes, described as a time of social decay, the remaining bonds will fall away.

(Śānti Parva, Chapter 227)

Sources

• Mahābhārata, Śānti Parva, Mokshadharma Parva, Chapters 223–224 (Bali’s rebirth as a donkey and his first teaching)
• Mahābhārata, Śānti Parva, Mokshadharma Parva, Chapter 225 (Śrī leaves Bali)
• Mahābhārata, Śānti Parva, Mokshadharma Parva, Chapter 227 (the second talk)